Cannabis Thread (CBD)

A little more about me… I reside in New York State, where the governor has announced to (try to) legalize cannabis in 2019!

I went to the doctor regarding leg pain in late 2018… he said the magic words… Opioids

to which I reacted with… NO!

He then said would I be interested in Medical Marijuana… now this is where it gets interesting…

I professed that I had tried it when I was in Art School decades ago and was not happy that I became paranoid…

He then stated that this was not like what you find on the streets… so basically I began this journey from pure ignorance… the world has changed in regards to this product since my experimentation in Art School. We now have Hybrids all over the place!

I told him that I’m an endurance athlete and would like to save my lungs… he told me unlike tobacco… to just vape and see how I feel… if any lungs issues, he would just switch me to edibles…

Being completely ignorant on this subject, I began my research on how to ensure that my lungs where not going to be harmed… enter the bong/bubbler universe… and one thing led to another…

I’ve already listed my tool kit earlier… and this is coming from someone who spent weeks researching this subject before pulling the trigger or even entering the dispensary (https://col-careny.com/medical-marijuana-product-offerings/

I’ve been doing this now for a few months and have not seen any issues… if I do… edibles be next…

We are each snow flakes… Experiment on yourself and then feel free to report your findings…

For me, not ever being a Smoker… this is a New World for me… and so far… a good one!

And this has been the issue when doing any kind of reading on the subject. Lack of data and facts. You either get anecdotes or research which isn’t entirely relevant.

Just to be clear - I’m not discounting your experiences, I’m just trying to find meaningful research on the subject. You are a single person who has done weeks of non-scientific research and found something that is working for you.

This is not the same as a randomized double blind study with a meaningful P value. That’s what I’m hoping to find!

Edit - to clarify the particulate risks I mentioned in my earlier post. The potential downsides appear to be less with lung function and more with inhaling toxic materials that will impact long term health (cancer risk, etc.). These items are potentially in the vapor because of the heats being used to generate it (in some cases north of several hundred degrees F) and the relatively low cost materials being used in the vaporizing products (not the actual CBD or whatever else is intended to be vaporized, but the containers and the like). Again - no one has studied this as far as I can tell, but there are similar studies in other areas around those heats and their impacts on plastics in particular

if you do switch to edibles be careful. and start with way less than you think you need. “YOU CANT PUT THE TOOTHPASTE BACK IN THE TUBE” certainly applies in this realm. edibles are fun and are really effective but can easily drift into the psilocybin/lysergic acid end of the spectrum if you’re not careful. some people, like myself, enjoy going deep into the murky waters like that. a little paranoid self reflection does the mind good in my opinion. but reality/sanity can get pretty slippery 2 or 3hundred mg in hahaha

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There are some studies out there but I don’t profess to have read them all.

Cannabis, Cannabinoids, and Sleep: a Review of the Literature

PURPOSE OF REVIEW:

The current review aims to summarize the state of research on cannabis and sleep up to 2014 and to review in detail the literature on cannabis and specific sleep disorders from 2014 to the time of publication.

RECENT FINDINGS:

Preliminary research into cannabis and insomnia suggests that cannabidiol (CBD) may have therapeutic potential for the treatment of insomnia. Delta-9 tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) may decrease sleep latency but could impair sleep quality long-term.

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I’ve used Kief in my Coffee… I’m well aware of the effects… and believe me… It was a fun ride… so now I save up the Golden Powder for when I want to have a Good Day!

My Girlfriend is well aware of this and has become the designated driver for our Outings on said Good Day! :wink:

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All you have to do is a quick google search for CBD studies in regards to inflammation, swelling and pain management, sleep issue, etc… plenty pop

This is science speak for ‘more data is required’ - note the key words are preliminary and may.

However - this is exactly the type of thing I’m excited to see. Once they finish with clinical disorders like insomnia they’ll start digging into things that could potentially impact the endurance community such as the impact on sleep quality and thus hormone release over time. Early stages still in that study, but definitely headed in a great direction

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Really? I couldn’t find any from a reputable source that was at all tied to endurance sports and recovery from such

If any of them reflect solid data that shows to help with inflammation and swelling or sleep improvements it therefore relates directly to recovery in any exercise.

You either can accept that there is data out there that supports the advancement of studies to the next level or you can say the data is not good enough for you. End of the day that a personal choice to take the time to read the data from the sources or not…

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I’m not sure I agree with you on the first two. Inflammation and swelling are associated with recovery and performance improvements - unless the studies tie these reductions to improved performance I don’t think that the correlation you propose would have the causation we are all hoping for

I picked up an Arizer Solo II recently. Steel convection plate and all glass hardware. All in an attempt to minimize the amount of unwanted particulate. Also keeping things in the 178-185F range avoids getting things too hot that you are getting some of the negative particulates that start around 195-205F.
You wouldn’t drink scotch from a dirty glass, I don’t know why you would want to consume other things any differently.

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Not to derail the CBD discussion, but given that we have a bunch of people in this thread posting from legal jurisdictions, it might be interesting to discuss the more ‘directly performance enhancing’ uses of cannabis when it comes to endurance sports in general and use of TR specifically.

Anyone who has spent any time in the trail running community will know that cannabis use is quite popular. Trail runners imbibing to get themselves ‘in the zone’ is a common use and this applies both in and out of competition. I’m not going to get into whether trail running as a competitive sport is covered by WADA or other antidoping orgs - I’m not a competitive runner in any sense so will leave that to others.

However the idea of getting ‘in the zone’ is one that absolutely applies to a tool like TR.

I have found that using cannabis prior to a TR session helps me immensely in terms of being able to complete challenging workouts. I’ve been a TR user for many years and always had variable results when it came to finishing hard 90 minute workouts in erg mode, which I consider the real specific value of the TR app. I find that consuming cannabis directly prior to a hard TR workout dramatically increases the chances that I will complete the workout successfully at the proscribed intensity.

Obviously this is seriously N=1 territory here but I find that being lightly to moderately stoned keeps me focused on the task at hand and reduces the stress/fatigue signals that my brain is sending out.

For me, the effect is so dramatic that I would call it ‘performance enhancing’ in some respects. Perhaps not any more than slamming a couple redbulls would be, but absolutely performance enhancing in terms of just being able to do more in my TR sessions than I would be able to do otherwise. Even when fatigued I find it easier to ignore the fatigue and push through.

I’m no longer a competitive bike racer and am just using TR for health and fitness, so I don’t have any guilt around cheating - regardless as has been stated WADA doesn’t prohibit cannabis out of competition so I likely wouldn’t be running afoul of any rules anyway. But it sure feels like cheating sometimes!

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My experience is the complete opposite. THC is the same as booze to me, strain dependent. Social, somewhat alert, but certainly not performance enhancing. You get a heavy THC content indica and that will just relax you and put you to sleep, which can be perfect if you suffer from insomnia and just need to turn your brain off and go to sleep.

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I can certainly see how your experience would be relatively common and mine less common. I’m an experienced cannabis user of 25 years or so, give or take, so I know exactly how I need to dose prior to getting on the trainer, and what works better or worse in terms of strains and even method of ingestion. As they say YMMV.

If it helps me relax then I rest better. If I could get more than 4 hours of sleep in one night? I would be in heaven. Sleep directly affects recovery. Recovery affects becoming stronger. See where I am going with this? The last time I had an edible was years ago and I slept for nearly 12 hours in the back of my car (we were camping and I have a wagon) I wish I could sleep like that every night! But its illegal where I live :frowning:

So, my recent experience FWIW.

TL;DR: CBD had no effect on me whatsoever.

I don’t drink alcohol or smoke weed. I have however taken my fair share of substances in the past, so I know what it’s like to feel something from chemicals. I picked up a knee injury (overuse, inflammation) a couple of months ago, and a guy at my work who works out told me he swears by CBD oil to reduce inflammation. I bought capsules from Holland & Barrett (UK health chain store) and followed the instructions. Tried 10mg in the morning, 30 mins before eating. No effect on my mood etc… and inflammation was clearly being helped by focused stretching by this stage. Moved up to 20mg. Maybe a slight feeling but tbh could equally be all in my head. Kept with it for 2-3 weeks before jacking it in. Might try 30mg out of interest for a week or so but I’m not impressed so far!

Far from science but my experience with THC and cycling (mtb) is that RPE going uphill is out the window. My performance may have been exactly the same but it feels very very different. You just can’t tell if you are working hard or hardly working. Downhills, however, are a different story and parallel my experience with THC and snowboarding, which is to say that it drastically improves my balance giving me increased control. Maybe it relaxes my muscles, maybe it relaxes my nerves, maybe it does both.

If I do it once a day, maybe 10mg a day (one “hit”), it makes me generally tired and needing to take naps and that feeling grows as usage continues. I currently do it once a week, if that.

Non scientific as well but paralleling my experience with CBD :
thumb_when-someone-offers-you-cbd-wow-the-land-of-make-38173838

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It doesn’t look like anyone has mentioned this obvious fact yet - Some people like getting the occasional Buzz. It is known that using alcohol for this purpose will decrease athletic performance and health by a debatable amount that increases with use. I think asking “How much does Cannabis use impact athletic performance?” is a perfectly legitimate question.

Even though it’s legal where I live I drive for a living so for the foreseeable future this is a moot point…

Bearing in mind that I tend to be pro-Cannabis since it has decreased the rate of opiate deaths in states where it is legal:

States with medical cannabis laws had a 24.8% lower mean annual opioid overdose mortality rate (95% CI, −37.5% to −9.5%; P = .003) compared with states without medical cannabis laws.

from: JAMA

By and large the data suggests that it is ergolytic…meaning it effects performance negatively.

One study specifically relating to cycling showed:

Renaud and Cormier3 showed that marijuana smoking reduce maximal exercise performance; when 12 healthy young adults cycled to exhaustion 10 minutes after smoking, exercise duration decreased from 16 to 15 minutes.

The effects of cannabis intoxication on the cardiovascular system include: elevated blood pressure, elevated heart rate, decreased cardiac stroke volume, and increased risk of myocardial infarction “heart attack” to list a few.

As per the CDC’s web site: (https://www.cdc.gov/marijuana/nas/heart.html)

  • The compounds in cannabis can affect the cardiovascular system. They can have effects on heart rate and blood pressure. Previous research has found a significant increase in the risk of heart attack in the hours after cannabis use13-15.

It has been shown that in the first hour after smoking cannabis that the risk of heart attack is 5x that without.

Since many of the intoxicating and vasoactive/cardioactive compounds are fat soluble they stick around and exert their effects for days/weeks.

Though the intoxicating effects of cannabis are interesting and fun I have to conclude that they aren’t worth it if one is interested in seriously training.