Cannabis Thread (CBD)

Good man. I have three Arizer products myself.

1 Like

Hey @chad maybe you could try to get Floyd on as a special guest to cover this, his new road team and career as a mtber turned roadie proā€¦

4 Likes

Whatā€™s concerning to me is what does WADA and the UCI classify as in or out of competition?

As THC can be found in tests for up to 4 months after use, how would they tell if this was used in, or out of competition?

Not worth the risk perhaps with so many question marks and lack of studies?

Itā€™d be nice to know the test subjects for the ā€œit stays in your urine for up to 100 daysā€ claim; i.e. overweight couch potato vs a fit endurance athlete. Iā€™ve heard the UFC uses a threshold high enough to allow fighters to pass a test as long as they essentially donā€™t smoke the day of a fight. I havenā€™t looked for the threshold with cyclists.

1 Like

Interesting point, if (as suggested) it does provide anti inflammatory benefits then it would be better than ibuprofen then Iā€™d much rather take this (if legal in the UK) than drugs which arenā€™t good long term for you stomach.

But I donā€™t want to fail a theoretical test.

2 Likes

I have zero knowledge of competitive cycling.

This is from an email recently sent to US Team athletes (not cycling).

ā€œAs of Jan. 1, 2018, cannabidiol (CBD) products are no longer prohibited by WADA and USADA, although CBD products can contain varying concentrations of THC, which remains a prohibited substance. Additionally, CBD products have been removed as a controlled substance by the U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency, and therefore athletes are no longer prohibited from the use or marketing of legal, WADA compliant CBD products. However, athletes must be aware that marketing CDB in a way that makes a claim of therapeutic benefit or any other disease claim, or the marketing of CBD products contained in food, beverage or as dietary supplements is prohibited unless explicitly approved by the FDA. Athletes should also be aware that the legal status of CBD in other countries is unknown (and we will not attempt to determine its status), and therefore marketing of CBD may not be permitted in every country where you participate.ā€

FWIW: I have 2x reconstructed ACL/MCL/meniscus in left knee and 2x torn meniscus and 1x ACL repair in right knee from late 80s non-cycling competition. Thereā€™s a 'couple staples and a screw still in the left. Iā€™ve struggled with swelling since my late 20s. To put more than 2,000 miles on my bike in a season meant a lot of ice and Advil. Iā€™ve been confined to being short-distance recreational rider since my late 20s. Running was not possible.

I donā€™t use THC recreationally. Iā€™m 100% ok with it for medicine. I witnessed THC as a life-saving game-changer for three friends and a family member who fought cancer and suffered the pain and appetite loss of chemotherapy and surgery. Two of them were staunchly anti-cannabis until, confronted with death and real pain, gave it a shot. I know several athletes who have suffered life-altering spinal cord injuries and all use THC to manage pain without the use of opioids. Seems like a no-brainer.

Since 2007 Iā€™ve maintained a very strict anti-inflammatory diet and have 10+ years of low CRP levels from blood marker tests, usually 2-3 per year. (Yes, Iā€™m one of those Quantified Self nutcases.)

My son and several of his friends that compete at the Olympic/World Cup level (not cycling, but high-stress/injury prone sports) convinced me to try CBD for anti-inflammation mid 2017. From their POV - the greater majority of elite athletes regularly use CBD as an alternative to ibuprofen.

2017 I did a tentative 2k miles.
2018 I did 3k miles. Not so tentative. Got in shape.
2019 Here I am! Maybe 5k miles? Looking in to Trainer Road.

Bucket list goals for riding are back on the table. And Iā€™ve recently started a small running program with hopes to finish a marathon (my first ever) in 2020 when I turn 50.

For me, CBD is simply an alternative to Advil that has mitigated inflammation better than Advil and ice. I believe itā€™s healthier than eating a lot of Advil.

CBD is expensive and can be really inconvenient to obtain. Quality is variable. Sometimes I run out of it. The swelling sets in, I pop the Advil and put on the ice and make a note to stock up on more CBD.

Just as any drug or nutrient, I donā€™t believe CBDā€™s effectiveness will be the same for everyone. I can drink 2 cups of coffee before bed and sleep like a baby. My wife would be up all night.

I donā€™t suffer from anxiety, trouble sleeping, or any of the other things some folks claim CBD helps with so I canā€™t provide any experience with that. Just have knees that swell up if I look at them the wrong way.

6 Likes

Todayā€™s New York Times science section has an article about the lack of hard evidence on the claims about using CBD. To quote, ā€œIndeed, a recent study that evaluated dozens of CBD products ordered online found that nearly 70% were not labeled accurately and had either higher or lower concentrations of the ingredient than indicated on the label. Some also contained THC.ā€ I am staying away from CBD until it is proven effective by well-designed scientific studies.

2 Likes

The quoted text doesnā€™t say anything about effectiveness though. It just talks about purity and labeling. Two different things.

I wonder if the appetite increasing effects of weed could be beneficial. Iā€™m nowhere near what I would call high volume. But I imagine anyone doing 10 hours or so of hard training a week would be in a constant struggle to get enough quality calories in them.

I could see anti-nausea effect of it helping some people as well.

CBD doesnā€™t give you the increased appetite that THC does.

1 Like

You are correct. here is a link to the full story;
Link

I think cbd oil is the new coconut oil. 95% fad. Could be wrong thoā€¦tell ya for sure in 2-3 years.

Is there marketing BS around it? Absolutely. Itā€™s the new kale, aƧai, coconut oil from that perspective.

But there are some better peer reviewed studies also coming out with some good results for specific things, such as pain mgmt.

Here is a podcast and poster from some internists interested in the topic. They interviewed an oncologist from UCSF who has researched cannabis. He discusses the limitations to conducting good research on the topic.

The Curbsiders: cannabis

1 Like

I like to make a butter coffee, kale, beet juice, cherry juice, acai, avacado, CBD shake in the morning on Sunday evenings. I sleep so good that I donā€™t have to sleep the rest of the week and set PRs every day. I do a whole base phase in two days and then spend the rest of the week doing over unders. 2 hours on, 30 seconds off. Iā€™ve killed a dozen trainers since January.

Might be anecdotal but I donā€™t find them to be a fad when Iā€™m seeing performance like this.

4 Likes

Iā€™m a big proponent for CBD usage. Itā€™s a phenomenal anti-inflammatory agent. With that said, I hold a Top Secret clearance; therefore, I cannot use this substance, which I think is retarded. Psychiatrists can get away with prescribing anti-psychotic drugs, and synthetic heroin, but CBD is being frowned upon? Give me a break

1 Like

If weā€™re talking long term studies on lung/health impact, this is the only study that I know of that utilizes longitudinal survey data to track cannabis consumption. Extensive focus on lung tissue as well since it compares to regular tabacco use. Daily cannabis users were only associated with an increase in potential for gum disease and gum health.

ā€œUnlike cannabis use, tobacco use was associated with worse lung function, systemic inflammation, and metabolic health at age 38 years, as well as within-individual decline in health from ages 26 to 38 years.ā€

2 Likes

OPSECā€¦ PERSECā€¦ā€¦ā€¦

ā€œCannabinoids are secondary metabolites. This means that they have no role in the cannabis plantā€™s growth. Instead, they work as an immune system for the cannabis plant, helping it to fight off pests, parasites, bugs, and predatorsā€ - it sounds very good to me.
I do believe CBD works with anti-nausea too.

1 Like

Last for about 30 days in your system thou, so thats a tight rope to walk with WADA