Combination of TrainerRoad and Xert

Thanks for your patience as i barrage you with questions lol… thanks for all your answers.
How does Xert react to your TR ramp tests? are they breakthroughs or does the TP usually drop?
I do not think that my Xert signature is naturally very accurate based on the data I’ve given it… when i load in my last 3 months of power data from strava, the TP is quite low and the PP is quite high.
I used the advanced MPA tool on each of my ramp tests where I adjusted the PP down until the Xert TP fitness signature matched the TR FTP. Was that a bad idea?

Yeah, that’s likely not quite right. TP for most people will be higher than FTP. I would do a hard race against a stronger field or a climb simulation and try to get a breakthrough and ride to failure. Then you can adjust your signature in advanced MPA tab to match your feelings. And keep accumulating quality data.

This isn’t TR related discussion anymore, maybe it is better to move it to Xerts forum…

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There is a workout in the Xert library for getting a breakthrough and from that an accurate signature, go to workouts and use the search bar, a few will come up, there is a specific one for doing on a trainer. I wouldn’t use ERG mode for it as you want to be able to put out maximal power.

If you can ride outdoors a good test to generate a good signature is to warm up properly, then do 5 or 6 30 full seconds gas with 15 second recoveries, after the last one ride above threshold for as long as you are able, just as you start to struggle to hold the power do an out of the saddle all out sprint, this should result in a breakthrough and reset your signature. I’ve been using Xert for a while now and find it very good, takes a bit of getting used to, it’s a different approach, but it has paid off for me. They are very helpful and if you are struggling they will respond very quickly if you contact them.

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LOL, yeah, I noticed how those numbers change constantly, if you hit recalculate. You’d think it would regenerate the same numbers, but they really swing wildly and are all over the place. It doesn’t give much confidence for the numbers, to be honest.

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It’s sort of like asking MyFitnessPal how much you weigh by inputting everything you ate. It depends on what your starting weight was. It’s the same with Xert; it depends on what your starting signature was. A recalculation by default uses your current signature and assumes it’s your starting signature. In the same way, if you insert or add rides before your first ride, things can change.

Xert uses signature decay by default to help correct things but if you do a lot of easy riding, then there isn’t a lot of information to help hone in on a precise signature. In these cases, having a good starting signature and/or using the No Decay algorithm for periods where there aren’t breakthrough rides is the best way to set things up.

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I’ve not used MyFitnessPal, or rather, I couldn’t care less about MyFitnessPal.

The signature decay, etc. isn’t really the issue, it’s that hitting recalculate seems to skew things in an odd way, and it seems to converge on increasing HIE too the max, if you keep hitting it.

What I ended up doing is entering 0 for everything and hit recalculate. It seems to come up with something “reasonable” but it still varies iteration by iteration. That’s what I was referring to. That the numbers do not seem to be deterministic. It’s like a roll of the dice to get the “fitness signature” that you want.

Weight loss was just used as an analogy to help better understand what the system is doing since how much you weigh today depends on how much you weighed yesterday and so on. Since signatures get propagated from the beginning, your starting signature can have a big impact on your current signature for some athletes and how much it will impact will depend on the nature and frequency of your specific breakthroughs (everyone is different).

Thanks for your comments.