Consistent difficulty in finishing Over/Under


I realised if i carry my mental baggage into this new training, i will face a bigger hurdle trying to get better.


thats quite a lot of calories! i am trying to watch my diet. blowing off close to 1k on a meal is not really an option! :smiley:


Just want to update this thread as well as clarify some doubts.

I am still having problems with O/U although now i am able to finish them without reducing intensity.

But for the rest of the workouts, i have been increasing the intensity by 5% to 8% and up to 10%.

Does that mean i am better at holding a constant power or my mental game is still weak when it comes to O/U?

Normally, the O/U falls after a long day of work the day before so not sure how much fatigue i am carrying into the workout.

But i always feel really strong for the next workout.


I’m no expert, but it sounds like you need to train over and unders. In general, I like to train what I am weakest at.


definitely. trying to find out how i can improve on it. even during outdoor rides, i find it hard to ramp my efforts up and down like that.


At this point it sounds mental. You have the capability and capacity to finish o/u. You need to go into them more positive and confident and refuse to fail them. You should look forward to o/u workouts as an opportunity to test you, challenge you and provide the growth and adaptation you need (book suggestion: Let Your Mind Run). Your mental game is a huge factor at play.

If you are raising other workouts by 5-10% consistently then your FTP is too low. Don’t keep a low FTP because you think you need it lowered just to finish o/u workouts.


I know that I’m going to get hated on for this but I really enjoy O/U-workouts. They make time pass more quickly and it always feels great afterwards. I have done Fang Mountain and Carpathian Peak so far but I’m really looking forward to doing Avalanche Spire on Thursday. Even though I’m going to do Junction -1 today. :smiley:


I tried going at it more positively. The first block went well for me. The second not so good and the last one was just tragic.

Will check out the book you mentioned.

Should I end my SSBMV2 first before adjusting my ftp?


I prefer 120% or more workouts. I think the harder but shorter intervals make the time pass a lot faster.


Yeah those are great too! I know that one of my weaknesses are longer steady intervals so everything below 20/15-minutes are golden for me. :smiley:


How far along are you? If you have at least a couple work weeks remaining, I’d say yes.

Is also available as an audio book on Amazon, well narrated.

This is when mantras and focus come into play to finish. The last interval wasn’t tragic, it instead tested you forcing you to adapt. You’re stronger now and will push further next time. “It was tragic” you say… Careful what we say to ourselves, because we’re listening” and ”Whether you think you can or think you can’t, you’re right.”


Mentally … don’t take them as a block, but take them as under, then over (or if it is the ramping kind, under, up, down). Take them one as a time, one o/u at a time. Not a block at a time. Smaller mental units help to create more success … kind of like being outside and seeing a sign 50 meters up the hill … not letting up, not changing gears until that sign … then the next 50 meters, and the next.


This is why I perform better on O/U compared to sustained long intervals like Lamarck.


I break those up into 2 minute drills, even if they are not suggested. Kick/pull, left/right, both, anything to break them up into smaller units.


I do this exactly, and think it’s great advice from my experience. The ramp up and the over part are the “work” parts and the under is the “break”. I’ve focused a lot on retraining my mind that a “break” doesn’t have to be backpedal or a light pedal with barely any watts… under FTP IS a break from the truly hard work :wink:


Honestly I think O/U are more of a mental workout than anything else. I still struggle with O/U but after 4 months of TR I finally developed enough mental toughness to get through them. In the end, the last interval isn’t any harder than the very first one. It sucks the whole way through. But if you can prepare mentally before and during the ride, you CAN get through it. Just keep grinding! Also keep in mind that the unders are designed to give you just enough time for lactate to clear. After every Over it feels like you cannot continue, but if you remind yourself that the burn will clear in 30 seconds, then you give yourself just enough hope to continue on. Now you just have to do that every single time lol😩