Estimated VO2 Max

ramp-test

#1

Could TrainerRoad provide an Estimated Vo2 Max using the ramp test and some other formulas?

Asking for a friend… :smile:


#2

How to Calculate Your Own VO2Max via Hunter Allen

Relative VO2Max = [(10.8 x W)/M] + 7

where:

W = watts
M = cyclist weight in kg
VO2Max = mL/(kg x min)


#3

Cool. And to simplify more, you can use the watts per kg on your TR profile screen:

= 10.8 x WpKg + 7

(assumes your weight and ftp are correct in TR)


#4

As noted in the comments to the article linked above, this formula will most probably underestimate the V02max for trained ppl.

As an anecdote, this formula estimates my V02max to be 52, but when I measured my V02max in a lab it was 67…


#5

+1
It was 12 higher in the lab for me


#6

Any idea how Garmin estimates VO2 max?


#7

@AndyGajda Garmin uses FirstBeat technology to estimate VO2max:


#8

Which is also very inaccurate, at least for me. Although YMMV :slight_smile:


#9

I’m using Edge 520 and Stages single-sided PM, and the Garmin/Firstbeat VO2max estimate seems reasonable but I’m not planning to have it lab tested to verify.

After reading Joe Friel blog posts and books on the topic, here’s one:
http://www.trainingbible.com/joesblog/2009/11/vo2max-and-race-performance.html

All I’ve been able to gather from my VO2max estimate is that I didn’t win the genetic lottery for aerobic capacity. But thats something I’ve known for almost 40 years, since running cross country in high school.


#10

First off, are you trying to estimate it for specific VO2 Max based workouts or just out of curiosity? The actual VO2 Max figure is widely useless in training and racing. While watts generated at VO2 Max capacity can be highly useful for targeted workout planning purposes and some racing applications such as a pursuit on the track or a short 5 min finishing climb. As to being useless in racing as a figure, the reason is that everyone is able to tolerate different amounts of pain and process biological waste products more or less efficiently. For example the Tour de France winner or even world champion pursuit winner on the track is not just the person with the highest tested VO2 Max. For example the highest tested VO2 Max athletes have been cross country skiers, while they could be good racers, due to specificity the high vo2 Max does not directly apply to cycling. Essentially your body can process high amounts of oxygen per minute, that is a metabolic measurement. However, a racer that can tolerate insane amounts of lactate, or really the hydrogen ions that build up in your muscles which causes the associated pain, can potentially produce far greater watts even at a lower tested vo2 Max. On one of the podcasts they alluded to this, I believe it was Jonathan, that mentioned in a lab he tested at 17 mmol at Lactate Threshold, now I’m that case the metabolic rate being tested is different but the same premise applies. Some athletes would not even be able to turn the pedals at blood lactate numbers that high, while some can endure crazy high numbers. However, in both cases regardless of the test, the ability to put watts into the pedals which actually powers the bike forward is a better measure of performance.

In this case, an all out 5 min effort is the best proxy for determining ability at VO2 Max. It will very closely approximate your maximum power sustainable at your VO2 Max level. Precise training plans and the performance enhancements that can result from following such plan can lead to very useful and applicable improvements on the bike. Both in training, but also more importantly in the movement of truth, either in getting into a break, or a late race attack with 2 laps to go, or a leg breaking climb at the end of a race.


#11

TrainerRoad @Nate should be able to give us the Vo2 Max from our Ramp Test’s!

Using the math from the video…

https://www.topendsports.com/testing/norms/vo2max.htm

For my age, I’m rated as Good!


#12

Hi,

Would be sweet if TR could implement a V02max estimate as well.

Anyone know if the formula in the video is applicable or can be adjusted to TR ramp test? It uses different ramp rates (6% of FTP/min vs 25w per 2,5min) so I guess it would show too high values if your FTP is above 166-167

For example, in order to reach the same peak power I would have to keep on going a lot longer time after reaching above FTP. I could not keep on ~5 minutes longer vs TR ramp test to reach the same peak power doing the test as advised in the video. Every second after 105% FTP hurts :slight_smile:


#13

Searching for some information on my Garmin Vo2 accuracy and came across this. Seems like some of the wearables are now producing decent numbers.

I don’t as a rule run my Garmin edge 1000 whilst using TR but will do so on selected workouts from now on, and definitely for the ramp test.


#14

@Jonnyboy

If you read through Firstbeat’s white paper on VO2Max, they note they believe their prediction to be within +/- 5%, but also that the accuracy of their prediction degrades significantly if you don’t know your true HRmax (most people don’t, as the age-based formula is #$%^, and finding your true max hurts, really hurts.


#15

Interesting. I’m pretty sure I know my max HR on the bike to within a beat or two. and I agree that it hurts!!


#16

Once you know your VO2 max, what are you going to do with it?


#17

@AndyGajda

Well, for me, seeing the VO2Max reported by my head unit gradually increasing over time is confirmation that my training is working.


#18

I sat down and did the maths on a few different calculations to estimate VO2 Max and they all gave me dramatically different results ranging from 39 to 77 with a mean in the 60’s. HRV4 gives me a guesstimate of 50 based on past workouts which I think is likely the most accurate.


#19

https://www.concept2.com/indoor-rowers/training/calculators/watts-calculator

If you know your VO2max power in watts, you can use these indoor rowing calculators to estimate your VO2max.

First use the “Watts Calculator” and enter your cycling 6 min max power in watts to calculate your erg pace which is a mm:ss.x per 500m unit measure.
Multiply your pace/500m by 4 to get your 2000m time.
Go to the VO2Max calculator and enter your weight and your calculated 2000m time and then calculate your VO2max number. I believe the result should be quite reasonable.


#20

Mine was out by 10 - predicted 81, whereas a lab test last Monday recorded 71.

Perhaps the online calculator knows I intend to drop a few kgs :wink: