Podcast 196. Nate and the special snowflake comment



I think some people are misunderstanding the term snowflake here. While a certain political party has been throwing that term around as an insult the message here was something really individualized that might not connect to a whole lot of riders. It’s important to realize that when you hear that in this weeks podcast.

People have the right to not listen to certain parts, if not all parts of a podcast. I feel like for the most part a lot of people love to voice displeasure with things over trivial matters. Kind of like the cycling/triathlon swap meet forum on Facebook. If someone posts something at a price that seem “high” to some people I see at least a few people who want to make snarky comments crapping on the person for the price they’re asking, rather then just moving because you are not interested in buying.

I think the comments Nate makes in relation to him are all useful within the context of the podcast. There are plenty of riders over 6’ tall who can relate. This is just something that doesn’t relate to you and that’s okay. Either listen and tune out/fast forward/stop listening if you really feel the need. I’ve never ridden xc mountain bikes but you’re not going to see me post a thread telling Jonathan to stop talking about it because it doesn’t relate to me.


I’d love to do this, only I’m a time trialist.

“So here as you see I’m still 7 miles from the turn. Still pedalling. Slight incline here, still pedalling. And now downhill, pedalling, but in a higher gear. Pedalling some more… and I’ve been overtaken by my minute man. There he goes… and I’m still pedalling. Oh, I dropped slightly below threshold and decided to change gear. Pedalling the 53-16 now. Just going past the turn-off to Marlow, which has a couple of excellent Michelin-star restaurants if you like fancy food. Worth a trip for a special birthday or anniversary. Still pedalling…”


I think the best think @Nate and the crew have going for them is that they’re not ex-World Tour pros or racing at an elite level. They’re relatable for the people that actually use their product.

I’m not crazy about all of the time spent discussing stuff to buy or marginal gains for average cyclists, but it’s a cycling related podcast and they obviously take pride in what they’re doing.

If I want my sports science fix or more in depth performance analysis I have a couple other pods that I won’t mention, but really, these guys do a great job representing the guys and gals that train hard and race hard to have fun. Kudos for that!


This isn’t the first time someone has expressed the sentiment. I’ve actually had a conversation about this at my workshop last weekend.

I kind’ve get it but see things differently:
I take this as Nate getting really excited about learning, improving himself, improving the product and ultimately helping his customers improve themselves. His questions ARE specific to a 6’6" dude but I also it is up to the listener to try to glean as much as possible and apply it to their own experiences – in other words, we all need to synthesize the info presented by everyone on the podcast. Maybe that’s just the ex-professor in me.

e.g. Physically I’m closer to Jonathan than Nate but in terms of what my body needs + can handle for nutrition I’ve learned a bit more from Nate and am happy that he experimented with stuff so I don’t have to.

As for the term “snowflake” . . . Man, that’s a loaded term these days and something that makes me (and others) cringe slightly. Whatever the negative connotation, I’m sure neither Nate nor Johnathan nor Chad mean it in that way but there’s probably a better way to express the idea that we’re all respond differently to stress/nutrition/etc.

This week I finished listening the ENTIRE podcast catalog. There’s a lot of gold! I absolutely appreciate what the T.R. team offers up on a daily/weekly basis (this includes your support staff). Thanks for doing what you do and offering a product that’s done more for me (physically + mentally) than any bike-related purchase I’ve made.

Last thing, posting things like “Take a chill pill” only serve to dismiss and isolate. Maybe some of ya’ll don’t agree but suss that disagreement out. One of the things that’s super cool about this place is that it promotes discussion and education. Shutting someone down shuts down the dialectic and ultimately does everyone + T.R. a disservice.


I wonder if there are snowflakes on Zwift? :thinking::thinking::thinking:


On the flip side, Jonathan has a very different body type to Nate and usually mentions a lot of good information that applies to smaller people. I like that all thre podcasters tend to talk about their own experiences. It’s refreshing to hear how different methods actually worked out for them, rather than hearing about what might work for me.


I have some sympathy for @FatBoySlim because he posted on what he felt and knew he would be in the minority.

I have noted the same thoughts myself and I cringed at the snowflake comment.

However the counter balance is that relating the content to a specific individual or situation does help illuminate that context for the rest of us.

I agree with the @elysianbike comment about taking the chill pill. That is just disrespectful to the OP


At 5’6” I enjoy Nate’s banter & anecdotes :laughing:


I actually like it when Nate starts making it about him, I also think it’s totally unintentional, to me it’s his passion coming through. At Specialized he was like a giddy schoolboy :grinning::grinning::grinning:. WHO WOULDNT HAVE BEEN?!


@Mw1692 I agree, and to some degree it’s good to head a) people questioning what they are doing and not just blindly “must follow plan” b) analysis of what they have done, to understand what worked and didn’t … even if what they are talking about isn’t relevant to yourself, can make you think about what is relevant to yourself


This is a really weird and disappointing thread — at least as far as the original post goes.

I love the podcast, and while I understand that the podcast is a means to an end as far as the TR business goes, it is still a ton of free content for me on a topic about which I am pretty passionate.

I, personally, really like the race takeaways.

I also admire the restraint @Nate showed in his response to this thread.

The fact of the matter is that any of us are free to not listen…no need to try and publicly excoriate someone.

Love the podcast. Love the product. (And I’m saying this having just finished Lion Rock - ouch).


I agree on all these fronts. I start to fade out when they’re pushing, err, talking about their setups, and the super deep dive into getting faster. It all come downs to the person, usually. Not because you were on a 9K venge disc with velotoze and aero helmet in a crit.

Also, when they start pushing the products they use, especially bikes, I think a disclaimer would be nice when it comes to products they are getting for free and at super discount. Which is probably everything. I think in the past Nate had would mention - okay we got these sent to us and here’s our thoughts or I paid retail for this and here are my thoughts on it. Might have been with some nutrition stuff. Can’t really recall.
Also, I get it. It’s a super popular podcast and partnerships/endorsements are going to come and that is fine.


You make a good point, the slobbering over Specialized and Yeti gear that they are getting for cheap/free should come with a disclaimer.


Bravo, Sir. Totally highlight of the thread!


I don’t really care about whether they get the stuff for free or not – but I will say that they have made several, repetitive disclaimers about Yeti and Specialized in the past. Not sure it’s fair to ask them to do it every time.


I’ve been listening through the entire catalog of the podcast, and the guys sounded stiff and too serious in the early episodes. Part of what I like about the evolution of the podcast is the discussion about their personal experiences and races, especially crits, because I glean a lot of information listening to @Nate share his experiences as a triathlete turned cyclist. I also understand the context of “Snowflake” and think it’s pretty sad that people can’t discern context and consciously or subconsciously weave their feelings political rhetoric into a cycling podcast.


I have been a podcast listener since the beginning and I couldn’t be more of a polar opposite from @Nate (5’6"/~150lbs) and I still can glean some takeaways that pertain to me from his experiences & questions asked, as well as everyone else on the podcast.

On a more general topic, I listen to quite a number of podcasts and all of the hosts talk about themselves, or at least relate topics to their own experiences to some extent which actually make it quite interesting. I would think just being lectured at and not “personal” to some extent would be really be boring to listen to.

As to the “snowflake” comment. It’s all in context. This is in no way a political show so the comment shouldn’t be construed as insulating to anyone. Since there are no two snowflakes alike the ask is that the questions not be so specific and unique but slightly more broad so they can be applied to a wider variety of riders.

To @Nate & the crew, keep doing what you’re doing. You’re guests always have something interesting to share and your individual experiences can be broken down and applied to riders at many different levels.


I try to mention everything that people send to us or we get on pro-deal.

We can get almost anything on pro deal though, so we do choose the products we want and then ask for pro deals.

If you have any questions just ask me and I’ll let you know how we got the product. I want complete transparency in this area.


Thanks for explaining this, “snowflake” must be a US thing. Never heard it in Thailand so wasn’t sure what “context” snowflake is useful.

@Nate, keep up the good work, the podcast is excellent. I’ll add my $.02, yes I understand you guys (and your product) is US based, but you DO have a global audience now. For 2019 you three or four or five should travel the world seeking out the best road, gravel, fondo, CX, MTB events and report back on them with awesome videos and podcasts.


I’m not going to apologize for anything. I had a point of view. I said I like Nate’s stories! They are fun and enjoyable. I am on the other side of the eating spectrum so I find that kind of boring. But when Nate is talking about his experiences in races and some of the cool or boneheaded things he does I feel that’s pure entertainment and I can totally relate!

My PT had a point and I can see where he is coming from. I don’t like specific questions about something that can easily be done in private and not on the podcast. Do I really care??? NO! This is constructive. Don’t like it! I’m cool with it.

As for a disclaimer… I don’t care what they use, how they got it, how much they paid, or if it was given to them for mentioning a product in their podcast. I know I can never afford what they ride and use. I don’t mind hearing about it to a certain point. But some of us buy a set of tires for a mountain bike and that’s what we use until they are worn out. Hell I used a cyclecross bike to ride 12000 km last year. I used it for road, cyclecross, gravel, crits and a 1600 km trip across 4 provinces. I don’t expect them to not talk about their equipment because I only have one bike.

I do not feel that they are shilling products or anything. They have an advantage over the rest of us as they are in this business. They have relationships with companies they can take advantage of. All the power to them. It would be silly for them not to! Im sure there are many riders that are not paying for trainer road. I would be surprised to hear that Amber or Jeff Kabusch(spelling?) or others are paying for trainer road(If they are great, if their not great, Nothing to do with my and I don’t care. These companies get a lot of airtime on the podcast and I get a lot of information out of this. That’s my payback. As well we get to hear about things a lot of us will never have! I think that’s fairly cool!
Podcast is great. I keep listening. Some wont.

Don’t need feedback tell me. I don’t need to waste my time!