Gearing still matters for ERG mode. If you were in too hard a gear then the trainer simply couldnt have lowered the resistance any further. This is the resistance floor of the trainer.
Thanks for this @bbarrera. I’ve been neglecting my stages for so long and just using the kickr power source. I did the ramp test with this configuration and the results were nothing to brag about. It actually sucked compared to my last ramp test with the kickr as the power source.
@DMC I’m not seeing a big difference, here is Geiger workout on May 22 using Kickr as power meter (and no power match):
(with Wahoo’s ridiculous power smoothing turned off)
and here is Geiger workout on Oct 31, with Kickr setup to use Stages as power meter (Wahoo’s version of power match, as I documented above):
Power Drift (Kickr on Trainerroad vs Garmin reading Stages Power)
and Hunter on March 1 with Stages PM and TR Power Match:
(most of my TR power match are “cleaner” than that, looks like my pedaling was a bit choppy that day except for that first 200+ watt section during warmup)
and Hunter on Oct 30 with Kickr setup to use Stages as power meter (Wahoo’s version of power match, as I documented above):
What do you call your trainer?
Hi yury I’m also using a bushido and just tried using powermatch with so garmin vector 3 pedals but I couldn’t get it to work at all. No resistance changes on the trainer. Did you struggle to get it to work?
A good chunk of the power difference between your Assioma’s and Direto is probably due to where the power meters are positioned. The Direto should read lower than the Assioma’s due to drive train losses. I think DC Rainmaker has this measured and documented somewhere.
I also have a Direto and have the same experience you do. Sometimes it takes it a little bit to adjust in Erg mode. I also wonder if it makes adjustments during an interval. There are times if an interval is 200 watts, as an example, if I creep over an average of 200 watts momentarily the Direto will adjust down to 185 watts for a few seconds to keep me at or below the 200 watt average. In Erg mode I almost always finish an interval at or below by 1 or 2 watts what the average should be.
Other than Elite’s app being wonky I have zero issues with my Direto.
I didn’t have a problem with Tacx Bushido and powermatch itself. With or without powermatch BT didn’t work on changing resistance in TR. I could change resistance with Tacx app via BT though. ANT+ worked right away, mobile or desktop. Occasionally the trainer would stop responding on requests to change power goal, but support told me they see connections drops in these cases.
I’m using a SRAM Quarq XX1 Eagle power meter with the Cyclops Hammer all via Ant+. Did find that cadence increases and interval changes in power were taking a long while to settle down in the power department
So I’ve been reducing the power matching time, originally allowed the default 10 seconds, reduced it to 5 seconds and as I find the hammer reacts pretty fast to trainer road input. Currently I’ve reduced to 3 seconds. Did Wynne last night ( intervals of varying power,length and cadence, believed it would be a good test for it) and found overall it tracked very well… I’ve found it reacts better and settles down quicker.
I guess its all dependant on your hardware and finding that “sweetspot”? Can imagine if you reduce sampling too much, you could end up with it chasing itself and never settling down. I’m happy where it is now so no more tweaking there!
I believe what you are adjusting is only a visual smoothing affect and not actually changing how often the power matches. Someone who knows for sure can chime in.
That would be interesting to know for sure… found this, its a bit old but seems to confirm what you have said… placebo effect for me then? Thanks for pointing that out
Not got my app with me, think its auto, manual or off… therefore auto would suggest you don’t have any control over sampling and feedback as with above, looks like I’ve got smoothing and matching mixed up in my head… just looks better visually then, so it would appear to me that it was settling down quicker, when in fact, it doesn’t make any difference to the setup!
Quick Question. Is it preferable to use the TR Powermatch feature over the Kickr Powermatch?
Kickr powermatch apparently, I haven’t seen official documentation confirming this, only runs when the Wahoo fitness app is running. Which seems crazy stupid, but ok. If that’s the case then TR powermatch is preferable.
I also heard the Wahoo app set to use Ant+ power only works when the app is open but I’ve been testing this by opening and closing the app and trying different configurations all week and as of now I’m fairly convinced once you set it even after you close the app it still uses Ant+ power. Every ride this week I’ve tested different settings and much prefer having the Wahoo set to use Ant+. Then TR settings power match turned OFF, Erg mode ON / and use power meter for cadence only. It’s by far the smoothest and most reliable for me as my intervals are finishing right on target. With that said let’s say TR shows my 15min. interval average at 180w, I found the same exact interval sent to my Garmin reading only my PM comes in 2-5 watts lower. This really bothered me at first but then I did the math and that’s on average no more than 2% difference. In the power meter world that seems to be acceptable. So for now that’s how I’m running it and might just bump up my workouts to 102% if everything feels good that day.
With KICKR SNAP controlled by Assioma UNO pedal and the same setup in TR I get the same numbers. Depending on the cadence or gearing I get +/- 5W difference between Garmin and TR readings.
That’s about same for me. So you also found once you set use Ant+ Power in the Wahoo app that it stays set even after closing. This is a big plus for Wahoo.
Wahoo’s “Control w/ANT+” has not been reliable, I’ve posted that in several threads. For that and several other reasons I’ve gone back to using TR PowerMatch. Switched back last night on Pettit workout and the second-by-second power recorded by TR app (Bluetooth) is virtually identical to power recorded by Edge 520 bike computer. The differences? All due to a few ANT+ dropouts between Stages PM and Edge 520.
did ramp test yesterday.
My setup si Tacx Vortex and Assioma DUO with automatic power match.
Usually the power match is quite good, only few strange “surges” during some workouts but nothing too bad, like in this workout
But, during the ramp test, the final minutes of the test were off
the power didn’t go higher (around 330W, not too fancy here)
cadence was around 90RPM all the time and gearing was something like 50x16
That looks like you experienced a dropout, just at the wrong time . I think your trainer never got the message to up the intensity for that last step.
damn… lucky me!
I will not repeat the test btw!
thanks for the answer
Thanks for the explanation Nate. Just to get a better understanding. Does Trainerroad constantly reaffirm the target power with the trainer or only tell the trainer the target power once at the beginning of the interval and then a new target power when that specific interval has finished?