I am solidly verestimated on both ramp and 8min tests. I have learned it is about 20 -30 points over what I consider my “functional FTP”. I use it to continue to gauge my fitness and then lower the new FTP by ~ 20-30 pts.
There’s no doubt about it, I am a one hill wonder aerobic beast. So I think I test too well on these short tests. But Heck No am I doing a 20 minute FTP test.
For your questions I think FTP being off on these test has to be common. you see how I correct for it, but no i don’t think software adapts. Good luck!
If you did 360W in the TR ramp test, your ftp would be 270W. So 240W seems quite a bit too low, and you’ll see better results if you increase it. If you’re worried mainly about the sweetspot workouts, try a 8min or 20min ftp test in TR. Both should give a better estimate of your ‘long duration’ ftp than the ramp test.
Or try to complete a workout like Lamarck in TR. The common perception is that it should be barely doable. If you don’t encounter problems, your ftp is too low.
I “over tested” on the ramp test and it made the workouts too hard and I quickly developed overtraining symptoms after 1 week. I started using what seemed to be a much more realistic FTP number for a few weeks and was way more enjoyable (still tough but manageable) and I feel way stronger now. I’m back at my ramp test FTP now. I’m sure it’s different for everyone but that was my experience.
@Ridill Recovery rates are personal and affected by a lot of things, but I feel like I shouldn’t need more than a day to recover from a SS workout, and should be fine to a basic endurance ride the day after.
@jamieborg You might just try a longer FTP protocol, too. You can also use TR’s workout creator (great tool, BTW) to develop Moore’s protocol into a TR workout. I’m going to plug that in place of my next ramp test and see how that goes.
@lxrchtt the TrainerRoad ramp test is a MAP test. As a ‘rule of thumb’ FTP is estimated as 75% of MAP. The point I’m going to make is that the LT2 of different riders will vary substantially from that 75%-of-map ‘rule of thumb’. This is what you are experiencing. Your the power at which you experience LT2 is less than 75% of your MAP. It’s not uncommon.
Consider the paper ‘Determinants of Endurance in Well-Trained Cyclists’ by Ed Coyle (yes, that Ed Coyle) and Andy Coggan (yes, that Andy Coggan). Some of those riders had LT2 at a power that was 65% of the minimum power that elicited VO2max & some of those riders had LT2 at a power that was 82% of the minimum power that elicited VO2max. Obviously, they found that the latter rider could time trial at 88% of VO2max A LOT LONGER than the former rider. That was back in 1988, btw.
So if you have some data that suggest a MAP test estimate of your FTP is too high relative to your actual LT2 threshold power…you’re probably correct! That’s true for a great many riders…
My FTP was set waaaaayyy to High!!
Start of “half distance triathlon base” Ramptest 251w
End of that I did a new Ramptest with 327w FTP!
2 weeks in to build phase my body crashed!
Now, 4 weeks later I will go back to Base Phase again!
But have set my FTP manualy to 285!
Very good points you guys have, really enjoy the discussion and the feedback. Just thinking, can it be that i am bad at the longer efforts right now because of bad nutrition, fastening?
Can it be that the impact of fastening and a slight calorie deficit is not really a problem for a short effort like the Ramp test. But will be a problem if anything longer comes along? I wonder if that my also can be a reason for this big gaps in FTP.
The way i understand it is that we have like 2 tanks where we can draw energy from. A small one with the good high quality fuel and a bigger tank with more fuel but not as good as the other one for endurance rides. Sorry the funny easy explanation i hope you get the point.
This just came to my mind.
Maybe the problem is that the big tank for endurance is not fueled well?
During that time my focus was on Weight lose and not Power increase in first place. Now my weight is where i like it to be and the focus has shifted from keeping weight lose to improve performance.
But that may be a explanation why i have this big gap on my FTP tests compare to the FTP i can do workouts at least in the past.
I am very pleasantly surprised by that. In a single week, I accumulated 5+ hours of indoor sweet spot at a wattage that until two weeks ago I considered my indoor FTP. So that’s a big thumbs up for the Ramp Test vs. British Cycling FTP protocol (30 minutes all out) in that respect: my indoor FTP is a little closer than I thought to my outdoor FTP.
New struggle this week: I did Apex today, a VO2Max/Anaerobic workout, and boy, did that kick my butt.
I had to dig deep to finish the first set and had to drop the intensity to 90% halfway through the second set to finish the workout. Barely. I struggled a lot in the last set.
So. New week. New challenge. Which is great in my book.