Should I Increase Volume?

plan-modification

#21

Half of working America earns the same or less on more than 30 hours/week…what’s your point? :neutral_face:


#22

This guy was a former elite athlete and had been at it on the bike for a few years prior to this story. He’s now racing the UK equivalent of the US domestic Continental circuit.

Can’t really compare his palmares to Marcotte, McCabe, and McNulty. All three have been top of the heap on Pro Conti teams and performed in much higher quality races against PC/WT riders. McNulty is just getting going and has a huge future. McCabe and Marcotte both have stripes and UCI wins.

Not knocking or saying I could do the same, just pointing out very different circumstances and a different “pro” level from the guys you mentioned.

Who knows? Maybe he’ll be the next Primoz Roglic…


#23

He played tennis…

Either way, he still went from spending the majority of his waking hours at a desk to doing nearly 30,000km/yr. Even if he “had been at it on the bike for a few years prior”, doesn’t change the math.

Question is: how did he avoid serious over-training even though that’s exactly what should have happened?


#24

My point had nothing to do with the American worker… I’m all too aware of that situation.

Im just a cycling fan and enjoy the irony of the video given the general lack of context as to what Pro even means when it comes to cycling and the way the sport is packaged for public consumption.


#25

Understand. I was just trying to say that M, M and M are quite talented and also had history (maybe not Brandon so much) and didn’t do what the UK bloke did. That statement doesn’t mean anything though and sort of why I wrote how amazed I am of people in general. I’m being sincere and just thought of Mike Woods. Just a few years of riding and top of the world tour. I understand his history as well but how he was able to turn that oxygen moving capability to cycling is nothing short of amazing.


#26

@Captain_Doughnutman this makes me think about the strange coincidence I keep seeing in former runners turned cyclist. They are all amazing! It all has to do with moving O2. If you were a runner I’m going to revise my recommendation and say add in that volume you were wanting to do. If you weren’t a runner then I’d say stick to the HV plan as is…I’m half joking half serious.


#27

All that extraneous stuff aside, the question still remains:

How did he avoid serious over-training even though that’s mathematically exactly what should have happened? (and I’m NOT insinuating illegal methods!)

Even if he was just a guy riding his bike with zero intention of “going pro”…increasing volume and intensity to that degree either causes serious high level adaptations or serious high level burn-out.

Guess anything is possible. :+1:


#28

Ski jumpers seem to be damn good cyclists too… Point being if you’re elite at any sport you probably have some type of physiological advantage.

In terms of training, everyone’s going to be a unique case.

The top riders (GC at least) aren’t the best because they’re naturally faster, they’re the best because they can naturally manage/handle the training. At least that seems to be the common denominator.

I’m baffled by the fear of overtraining that power based cyclists in particular seem to have. Yes, you should ease into any new training regime. Yes, masters athletes need to recover more than 25 year olds, but you should be comfortable pushing limits.

I’m more concerned about the mental well being of someone that can’t take a day off the bike when they need it or move a workout in their plan without fear of their FTP dropping 2 watts…

Overthinking scares me more than overtraining and is probably equally detrimental to performance…


#29

Totally get it. I was just adding context as to most a pro is a pro is a pro and people aren’t generally familiar with the structure of the sport. This guy is super impressive and a major talent. No doubt about it. Hopefully he finds a good ride for 2019.

Woods is just unreal. Another level again.


#31

I’m confused, SPBHV has 6 workouts a week :thinking:

If you decide to go for it, can’t wait to see the “up and to the right” TSS chart.


#32

I didn’t count the Z2/Endurance days.
There’s 2/week in the plan, I did 1/week.

You know us Crazy Canucks!! :crazy_face::canada::laughing:


#33

Kiel Reijnen‘s (Trek) response: “If I was talking to a 21-year-old Kiel, I’d probably tell him to find a better job with more security and a 410K salary, but seriously…”


#34

Going back to your original post, I suspect you have made your mind up anyway, and are looking a little affirmation. :wink:

The way this forum is you are always going to get a considered response rather than a ‘go for it and see if you explode!!!” answer, but there’s a fair chance that you’ll cope with the increase as long as you plan the rest. I would manually play with the plan and ramp things up over the next few weeks if I were you,

Edit to add: I took a look at the SSBMVII & HVII plans (I’m starting the former next week) and for me, I think that MVII is the harder plan and will drive more adaptation and improvement than just increasing the amount of SS work that HV brings


#35

I’ve had the same thoughts about MV vs HV, and if my A Race was a RR then I’d probably go with MV (maybe with a few tweaks); but my goal is a TT so I’m going with what’s more inline with the 40K TT Spec plan.

My decision on increasing volume has definitely not been cemented! Admittedly, I am kind of an all-or-nothing kinda guy but as I have no experience in the matter at hand, I have to get that from the wealth of knowledge here on the TR forum.

I’d still like to give it a go and see what happens but perhaps the timing is not optimal, at least not for an all-in effort.


#36

That makes a lot of sense, you are effectively bringing some specialisation to your build phase. Good choice IMO


#37

I’d strongly recommend you not increase volume any further. If you want to continue doing the increases you’ve done over the past few plans which has you in that 750-850/week range go for it (until you can’t) but I wouldn’t take another step up in volume at this point.

I think of it this way. 800/TSS/week is a lot and will continue to drive improvements for you, particularly given your prior training volume over the past few months and years. Your benefits of bumping up to 1k will be small - you’re on an upward curve either way - so it shouldn’t drastically change your fitness gains for this season for the better. The risk, however, of burning out (either mentally or physically) is higher.

Therefore - well defined, but relatively low upside is being compared to an unknown but relatively large downside. I would always recommend you take the more conservative approach given those two choices.

If you can maintain 750/TSS a week (with rests, etc.) over the course of this season then NEXT year you should look at increasing volume and pushing harder. You aren’t at your fitness ceiling for 750/TSS/week - when you get there then you can increase volume if you are still up for it

Unrelated - @Captain_Doughnutman look at the workout I did last night - I think you might enjoy that one with your VO2 capabilities and ‘love’ of over/unders

Having completed SSBHV I think it does suit all sorts of racers. You won’t see any adaptations for your race season during it, like you do during SSBMV, but you should be at a minimum 8 weeks away from racing when you finish SSB and more realistically something like 12-16 weeks out. The adaptations for more dynamic types of racing can easily be accomplished during that period of time.

SSBHV is not for everyone - but saying that because it doesn’t have threshold or VO2 work it isn’t appropriate for road racers is a bit of a mistake. That’d be the same as saying the fundamental principles behind traditional base are flawed because people need to go fast 3 months later. You aren’t focused on building those systems in base - don’t stress about the lack of over/unders or threshold stuff


#38

I think you are accidentally misinterpreting me there, I wasn’t suggesting anything other than that I believe MV is a better fit for my circumstances. I do mostly MTB work and gravel, and my A race is in April, so I won’t be doing a speciality phase before then.


#39

I think it is much more about timing than the type of racing you do - totally agree with you for your circumstances (starting base phase 12-14 weeks from your A event is rough no matter what!). If you were able to start your training at the normal distance from your A event and had the time/capability for HV I still think it would be better for MTB and gravel events


#40

I’m really not sure, even if you add a speciality phase in there. But I don’t have enough knowledge or experience to be definitive on it. Although I have always thought that both pushing from below and pulling from above at your current limits is a good thing.

Just to turn it around slightly, why does MV have so much more work above threshold? Is it simply to match required weekly TSS with expected hours for a mid volume plan? or does it confer something more.


#41

This - there isn’t enough time in the mid volume plan to get the adaptations from only sweet spot